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IRC Meetups/2005/July/July20RawLog

[17:00] <photomatt_wrk> let's get started I suppose :)
[17:00] <Podz> <meetup>
[17:01] <relle> http://codex.wordpress.org/Fundraising_and_Promotions
[17:01] <relle> WE NEED HELP - sign up and get involved.
[17:01] <stevecooley> my brother's asking me if there's any talk of the Atom API in the xmlrpc.php processor?
[17:02] * Joins: Twidget
[17:02] <Twidget> dang! I miss much?
[17:02] <shep|lappy> no
[17:02] <photomatt_wrk> stevecooley: add that to the agenda - http://codex.wordpress.org/IRC_Meetups
[17:02] <photomatt_wrk> relle: could you talk a bit about what that group is doing?
[17:03] <relle> We are coordinating the media coverage and promotions of WordPress.
[17:03] <stevecooley> oh. Cool. thanks
[17:03] <relle> We're making a list of PR resources to hit up when events happen and need publicity.
[17:03] <relle> Ideas and plans are being generated for fundraising and other kinds of awareness raising events.
[17:03] <relle> It's a lot of work but a lot of fun.
[17:03] <relle> Helping to promote WordPress.
[17:04] <relle> If you have any experience in PR, please help.
[17:04] <photomatt_wrk> what is typically involved in helping out that group?
[17:04] <relle> We need people to handle the day to day stuff and then...
[17:04] <relle> take on events and such.
[17:04] <westi> jefte: it should be possible but.. will need some nifty rules.. DrBacchus maybe of more help than me when he's around
[17:04] <relle> Right now we're doing a lot of research to build up a "library" of reviews and info on WordPress
[17:04] <westi> sri wrong channel
[17:05] <Podz> "media" - ?
[17:05] * Joins: jefte
[17:05] <relle> We're planning to write press releases for all kinds of wordpress stuff like an announcement I hope photomatt will make later.
[17:05] <relle> About the forums.
[17:05] <relle> And coordinating between the different groups like forums, codex, hackers, etc.
[17:05] <relle> For instance, we're working on Backup Week which connects forum and codex.
[17:05] <relle> We need grunt work, stamp licking, emailing, research and leadership for events.
[17:06] <relle> Recruitors, coordinators, everything.
[17:06] <michel_v> "WordPress is just getting started to move from a one man show to a serious non-profit volunteer organziation."
[17:06] <relle> bingo
[17:06] <michel_v> I have serious issues with parts of that statement, but I'll just shut up and lurk
[17:06] <relle> There is a LOT of stuff going on and we need volunteers to spread the wealth of energy.
[17:07] <relle> For a long time, matt has been the "bill gates" visible person for WordPress.
[17:07] <relle> So?
[17:07] <relle> The different volunteer groups have all kinds of activities they need to do and we all need to work together to help promote them.
[17:07] * Joins: robla
[17:07] <shep|lappy> relle: bad analogy
[17:07] <relle> We build teams.
[17:07] <shep|lappy> we LIKE matt
[17:07] <relle> And I like Bill.
[17:07] <relle> Grew up not far from him.
[17:07] <shep|lappy> you just want his money
[17:08] <shep|lappy> :P
[17:08] <relle> Anyway, we need representatives of the different groups to help us help them.
[17:08] <relle> We need help from those working on 1.6 to get information on promoting it.
[17:08] <photomatt_wrk> so I guess in conclusion, if you or someone you know would be interested in that sort of work, please point them at that page and contact relle
[17:08] <relle> All of this is normal stuff so we need help.
[17:08] <relle> Yep.
[17:08] <relle> http://codex.wordpress.org/WordPress_Backups
[17:09] <relle> I've already mentioned it but we need a lot of HELP in the forums starting Friday for the next week.
[17:09] <relle> Podz, want to talk about it?
[17:09] <Twidget> Maybe this is stupid, I dunno, but any way to get in good with the Linux people? Cross-promotion or something?
[17:09] <Podz> the guides are done, all shall be cool :) (It's cannot be worse than a release !)
[17:09] <relle> Twidget: contact me later about that.
[17:09] <Twidget> k
[17:10] <relle> Hackers recently discussed some good things about backups that have been directed to the forum group.
[17:10] <relle> Their perspectives should help volunteers answer some questions about it.
[17:10] <relle> It's exciting.
[17:10] <relle> and the plugin?
[17:11] <Twidget> God, I hate the wireless in hotels
[17:11] <relle> podz?
[17:12] <Podz> skippy's work ? It's excellent
[17:12] <photomatt_wrk> is there any reason we emphasize 5 pages of instructions over a 1-step plugin?
[17:12] <michel_v> Twidget: there are packagers for most linux distros
[17:12] <relle> Because the plugin doesn't always work.
[17:12] <relle> People are afraid of them.
[17:12] <Morydd> teach a man to fish... etc.
[17:12] <relle> And some people want to do it manually.
[17:12] <jalenack> has the meetup started yet?
[17:12] <michel_v> Twidget: the need in this area is for more communication with them or help with their releases when a new WP version is out
[17:12] <Podz> skipy's plugin should do the job, but no harm in telling others using phpmyadmin
[17:13] <relle> skippy and ringmaster have been working OVERTIME on this to get the bugs out.
[17:13] <relle> It's almost ready.
[17:13] <photomatt_wrk> cool
[17:13] <relle> For those who don't know, it is a plugin to provide a backup that will allow downloading to server, email or desktop
[17:13] <relle> It's one click PLUS
[17:13] <stevecooley> that sounds awesome
[17:13] <relle> But my site breaks it every time so we're still testing.
[17:13] <relle> ;-)
[17:13] <mdawaffe> http://www.skippy.net/blog/2005/07/12/wordpress-database-backup/
[17:13] * Joins: skeltoac
[17:14] <shep|lappy> works great on my 2 blogs
[17:14] <relle> We NEED YOUR HELP.
[17:14] * Joins: deeje
[17:14] <shep|lappy> i'm enjoying it greatly
[17:14] <Twidget> I'll chat with relle more later, since she asked me to, I just meant that they're a great bunch of folks to have enthused about your software package, and you definitely want them on your side
[17:14] <relle> We still need help to promote WordPress.
[17:14] <relle> WordPress Backups
[17:14] <relle> Sorry.
[17:14] <stevecooley> "my two blogs" - a new sitcom coming this fall to UPN!
[17:14] <relle> Please post informatoin on your site and help us keep the topic alive over the next week.
[17:14] <shep|lappy> :P
[17:15] <relle> NEXT: Maintainer needed for the Theme Viewer
[17:15] <shep|lappy> meaning?
[17:15] <Podz> shadow has been in touch
[17:15] <relle> photomatt_wrk: ?
[17:15] <shep|lappy> someone to add new themes when they are released?
[17:15] <relle> macmanx said no.
[17:15] > i've an idea for promote WordPress Backup Week...
[17:15] <Podz> He may do it ... but we may have to plead a little :)
[17:16] <photomatt_wrk> basically we have shadow's theme viewer, currently hosted at themes.wordpress.net
[17:16] <photomatt_wrk> we either need to take it down or keep it up to date
[17:16] <mdawaffe> http://themes.wordpress.net/theme-viewer.php
[17:16] <Podz> traffic ?
[17:16] <Podz> does it get much ?
[17:16] <shep|lappy> i say keep it up, and up to date
[17:16] <Morydd> what's up with wp-themes.org?
[17:17] <photomatt_wrk> I can check it out now
[17:17] <shep|lappy> i think its something that is very useful
[17:17] <Podz> who owns wp-themes ?
[17:17] <mdawaffe> shep|lappy: I think everyone wants it up, but someone needs to be in charge of it
[17:17] <relle> I believe the responsibilities lie in accepting submissions of themes and then posting them on the site. If they don't work, they are dead and maybe the maintainer will email the author but NO FIXING.
[17:17] <relle> only maintaining.
[17:17] <Podz> it's still a job
[17:17] <shep|lappy> relle: that sounds good
[17:18] <photomatt_wrk> the site is also very slow, maybe it needs some code work as well
[17:18] <relle> So you want it?
[17:18] <relle> shep|lappy: you don't have time.
[17:18] <shep|lappy> i know i don't
[17:18] <shep|lappy> but that *shouldn't* take too much time
[17:18] <shep|lappy> if no fixing is involved
[17:18] <photomatt_wrk> okay stats
[17:19] <photomatt_wrk> in june it did 900k pages
[17:19] <relle> It's not been heavily promoted.
[17:19] <relle> And it DOES need code work.
[17:19] * westi is now known as westi|gone
[17:19] <photomatt_wrk> that number seems high
[17:20] <shep|lappy> is that counting everytime a theme is chosen?
[17:20] <relle> So shep|lappy are you taking responsiblity for it?
[17:20] <shep|lappy> if there is codework involved, no
[17:20] <photomatt_wrk> looks like only around 20k visitors, but each of those visitors turned a ton of pages
[17:20] * shep|lappy is not a coder
[17:20] <shep|lappy> hit me up in a month, and i may be able to
[17:21] <stevecooley> is the concept that screen grabs don't adequately describe the experience?
[17:21] <shep|lappy> as of now, i'm swamped
[17:21] <relle> We have a lot of such positions needed. Is there any way to feature a Help Wanted in the dev blog like every two weeks with a list of positions open?
[17:21] <relle> stevecooley: yes
[17:21] <photomatt_wrk> I think a help-wanted post is a good idea
[17:21] <photomatt_wrk> we have mostly the same people in these meetups, and we're all doing things already
[17:21] <relle> True
[17:22] <Morydd> is wp-themes.org defunct? and why is themes at .net rather than .org?
[17:22] <Podz> wp-themes - not belong to matt ?
[17:22] <Podz> .org I mean
[17:22] <photomatt_wrk> I have that
[17:23] <Podz> ah .. must be mixed up
[17:23] <jalenack> Firas and I are starting to work on a new WP extensions site.. like wp-plugins.net .. with downloading from the admin panel
[17:24] <photomatt_wrk> keep us updated with how it's going
[17:24] <relle> So I'll help you put together a help wanted list for the dev blog, photomatt_wrk
[17:24] <photomatt_wrk> Let's move on to the next item
[17:24] <jalenack> ok
[17:24] <relle> one last backtrack
[17:24] <mdawaffe> photomatt_wrk: is theme preview and automagic still a long term goal of wp-themes.org?
[17:24] <relle> PotterSys: you had an idea for backup?
[17:24] > yes, a little idea about promoting backup week
[17:24] <relle> go
[17:24] <relle> tell us.
[17:25] > do you remember Make Poverty History web whiteband?
[17:25] <relle> yeah
[17:25] > i think we would do something like that
[17:25] > to all sites that have been backuped
[17:25] <Morydd> guess I don't get an answer then?
[17:25] <relle> jonimueller is working on buttons and banners.
[17:25] <shep|lappy> or have it link to codex page for backups
[17:26] <relle> I think that is a great idea.
[17:26] <relle> I'll get you info to help joni if you want and we can put that into the process.
[17:26] <Twidget> I dunno about that
[17:26] > ok, i'm on winter holiday right now :)
[17:27] <Twidget> I mean... you'll have the WordPress banners on WordPress blogs...
[17:27] > and do something like site tracking
[17:27] <Twidget> The banner worked because it went up everywhere
[17:27] <relle> I think as an optional thing, it would be fun. People can take them down when they like. Show support.
[17:28] * skeltoac is now known as skeltoac|away
[17:28] <Twidget> A WP banner on WP blogs would be like preaching to the choir
[17:28] <shep|lappy> not everyone who uses WP backsup though
[17:28] <relle> No argument but non-WordPress users also visit WordPress sites.
[17:28] <shep|lappy> i could tell you a handfull of people at the top of my head who don't
[17:28] <Twidget> Maybe many different badges to choose from
[17:28] <relle> There are a bunch that joni has worked on.
[17:28] <Twidget> or this: a toe-to-toe with MT
[17:29] <relle> They will be announced on the forum on Friday.
[17:29] <jefte> that kind of widespread marketing should not be done until the WordPress logo and identity are set in stone
[17:29] <Twidget> that too
[17:29] <shep|lappy> i don't think this should be so much about promoting WP right now as much as promoting backing up
[17:29] <photomatt_wrk> the new logo isn't different enough to confuse people when we change
[17:29] <relle> Then get involved with the PR team and we can talk about it there.
[17:30] <photomatt_wrk> it's just an evolution
[17:30] <shep|lappy> and i think that was pottersys' idea
[17:30] <jefte> photomatt_wrk: is the logo ready for primetime? if so, I'm for promoting site badges or banners
[17:30] <photomatt_wrk> we're held up on the site design to go with it
[17:30] <relle> NO Wordpress logo is on the backup buttons.
[17:30] <shep|lappy> so
[17:30] <jefte> its not about confusing, you just don't to dilute the brand
[17:30] <jefte> *sp
[17:30] <relle> This is the first draft: http://babygotblog.com/2005/07/18/babygotbackup/
[17:30] <Twidget> I don't mean to diss out, PotterSys, I'm just thinking it's a little... myopic
[17:31] <Twidget> diss you, er
[17:31] <relle> I don't think the few people that will have fun with this and put them on their site is going to impact WordPress in ANY way.
[17:31] <relle> This is a little fun gimmick.
[17:32] <shep|lappy> right
[17:32] <relle> It is NOT a major advertising campaign.
[17:32] <jefte> In a grass roots effort like this, it is major
[17:32] <relle> Next year, if we do it again, we can plan three to six months in advance and make it a serious campaign.
[17:32] <shep|lappy> like i said, this is more promoting backups rather than WP as a whole
[17:32] <photomatt_wrk> So we'll have a graphic and code people can put on their sites to promote the backup week
[17:32] <photomatt_wrk> ideally a little chunk of javascript
[17:32] <relle> And it needs to be done by tomorrow!
[17:32] <photomatt_wrk> we can host that on static.wordpress.org to make it easy
[17:34] <relle> This is why putting together the PR team is so important.
[17:34] <relle> all of these details can get figured out and planned for.
[17:34] <relle> Very good points and we need that kind of input.
[17:34] <photomatt_wrk> okay next we have " Status of latest Forum software updates"
[17:34] <relle> Thanks, PotterSys
[17:34] <relle> mdawaffe?
[17:34] > de nada :)
[17:34] <mdawaffe> Pagination almost everywhere (though it's a little odd on Profile pages)
[17:34] <photomatt_wrk> the functionality has been updated, I still need to update the stylesheets to match
[17:35] <mdawaffe> Menu on Profile pages for further info/admininstration
[17:35] <mdawaffe> tag feeds
[17:35] <mdawaffe> what else?
[17:35] <Podz> superstickies ?
[17:35] <mdawaffe> Podz: ?
[17:36] <Podz> a sticky right now is in one forum. looks no different on main page. supersticky could be colored, sticky on main page
[17:37] <photomatt_wrk> Podz: that's more a template change, that we could do in special situations
[17:37] <photomatt_wrk> I don't think that's worth having in the software
[17:37] <Podz> for things lik no codex, maybe new versions. Rare use, but useful all the same
[17:37] <Podz> k
[17:37] <photomatt_wrk> when you think that's required, please let me know
[17:37] <Podz> np
[17:37] <photomatt_wrk> " Dashboard feed situation? - Why isn't it working? Or is it?"
[17:37] <photomatt_wrk> should be working
[17:38] <rcbulldog> Is article expiration on the list anywhere?
[17:38] <mdawaffe> no planet feed
[17:38] <Podz> it's not working here
[17:38] <mdawaffe> dev blog comes through fine, though
[17:38] <photomatt_wrk> hmm, it looks like a bug in the software
[17:39] <photomatt_wrk> caused by my post where it says Dawn & Drew
[17:39] <photomatt_wrk> short term, I'll change that title
[17:39] <photomatt_wrk> longer term, we should switch to FeedWordPress instead of this funky python thing we're using
[17:39] <photomatt_wrk> fixed, moving on...
[17:40] <photomatt_wrk> I see the IRC topic is brought up again, is anyone actually interested in discussing that?
[17:40] <relle> Granting voice to regular users who are helpful, a way to show who is knowlegable and trustworthy in #wordpress
[17:40] <photomatt_wrk> I think it's been run into the ground already
[17:40] Auto Away deactivated, manual Away set:?10 Putting some kerosene
[17:40] <Morydd> really?
[17:40] <relle> Well, they wanted a voice and didn't get one.
[17:40] <relle> so to speak.
[17:40] <photomatt_wrk> no, everyone has the same voice
[17:40] <photomatt_wrk> it's the exact same situation as on the forums
[17:40] <photomatt_wrk> and I don't think we should do it for the same reason we decided not to create different classes of people on the forums
[17:41] <relle> At the last meeting it was decided that they would get together and bring questions to the meeting on what they wanted on the Codex and within the chat.
[17:41] <shep|lappy> because we are communists?
[17:41] <photomatt_wrk> open source = communism? ;)
[17:41] <relle> Excuse me? There ARE different levels on the forum already?
[17:41] <shep|lappy> :P
[17:41] <relle> And the volunteers are debating having a "label" for their status.
[17:41] <relle> And it isn't status but honor.
[17:41] <tunicwriter> Uh, yeah, heh. "Support Maven" seems to be a different level to me...
[17:41] <Podz> that debate seems to have died
[17:41] <stevecooley> Funny, you called them "volunteers"... seems like a good label to me
[17:41] <photomatt_wrk> relle: on the forums there's an administrative levels, which is required for maintenance
[17:42] <relle> And I think "volunteers" is a great name for those who volunteer actively on the forum.
[17:42] <photomatt_wrk> it's 1 or 2 people, not a whole bunch and there's no voting process or anything
[17:42] <relle> It's recognition.
[17:42] <photomatt_wrk> the bare minimum needed
[17:42] <photomatt_wrk> on IRC we don't need administrative people policing things
[17:42] <photomatt_wrk> freenode handles that
[17:42] <shep|lappy> agreed
[17:42] <tunicwriter> Voice has no administrative powers...
[17:43] <relle> Anyway, the volunteers group is working that out for themselves and I'm sure you will honor whatever they come up with to recognize their volunteer status.
[17:43] Back:? Away for 3mins 5secs
[17:43] Away Deactivated:?4 Auto Away reactivated
[17:43] <Morydd> yet your argument for relegating IRC to be a secondary support resource was that the policing wasn't happening.
[17:43] <photomatt_wrk> so it's a meaningless title handed out to show who our "favorite" members are?
[17:43] <photomatt_wrk> we might as well make people dukes
[17:43] <photomatt_wrk> or knights
[17:43] <Morydd> or mavens
[17:43] <stevecooley> haha
[17:43] <mdawaffe> photomatt KWP
[17:43] <tunicwriter> No, it's a title like one you gave to Skippy and Podz.
[17:44] <relle> On the forum, giving the active volunteers a title of volunteer honors their time, lets everyone know the forum is RUN by volunteers.
[17:44] <Podz> I nominated Skippy, Not Matt
[17:44] <tunicwriter> Unless you gave them that title because they're your favorite members, then my argument is null.
[17:44] <mdawaffe> tunicwriter: that title is only for administrative purposes
[17:44] <mdawaffe> content control only
[17:44] <relle> Still, it's up to the forum volunteers to come with their own methods as a group.
[17:44] <shep|lappy> i'm out kids
[17:44] <tunicwriter> It's still there, and people email and call, even, Podz for support, though he doesn't want it, and he's looked to for support.
[17:44] <photomatt_wrk> I don't think *anyone* would argue Podz needs admin powers on the forums
[17:44] <shep|lappy> was someone logging this?
[17:44] <mdawaffe> (and it's not a title so much as a function)
[17:45] * Joins: skeltoac
[17:45] <Morydd> then why should it be displayed at all?
[17:45] * Quits: shep|lappy ("(? www.nnscript.de ::? NoNameScript 3.81 ::? www.?XLhost.de? )?"?)
[17:45] <Podz> I don't see the point of +v on here simply because how do we decide ? We've got so many different people who are good at different things
[17:45] > i'm logging by default
[17:45] <Morydd> also on the forum you can click on "member" or "maven" and see the history to see how people have contributed.
[17:46] <photomatt_wrk> to summarize
[17:46] <mdawaffe> Morydd: because it's good to know who the moderators are so if you see something offenseive, you can direct the right people to it
[17:46] <photomatt_wrk> on IRC to give people titles would create a class distinction between people in the chat
[17:46] <Morydd> and "Mavens" doesn't?
[17:46] <photomatt_wrk> and we would need a complicated and PITA process to decide who gets titles and not
[17:46] <photomatt_wrk> and people who didn't have titles would be pissy
[17:46] <Morydd> all of which are potentially true of the "mavens" title
[17:47] <mdawaffe> Maven = Moderator. Perhaps the name is poor.
[17:47] <stevecooley> "Maven" makes me think of "Mavis Bacon teaches typing" box covers
[17:47] <Morydd> maven, moderator, duke... they're all titles, distinctions separating them from the "members"
[17:48] <tunicwriter> They should be distinguished from regular members.
[17:48] <photomatt_wrk> I'm not going to grant people voice on #wordpress, if people want to start an alternate channel where everyone is segregated somehow into ranks and classes that's fine
[17:48] <Tom39|work> Amen.
[17:48] <Podz> Morydd:: at least if something like editing / closing / deleting happens on the forums, you know it is one of only 5 people. How else would you know ? Do we grant all ?
[17:48] <tunicwriter> It's not segregation, it's pointing to people who can help others, which is what the channel is usually used for. But do what you want. It's not my project.
[17:49] * Parts: Twidget ("I've left"?)
[17:49] <Morydd> so much for "WordPress is just getting started to move from a one man show to a serious non-profit volunteer organziation."
[17:49] <relle> Okay, I'd like to sum this up. For now, the #wordpress channel stays as it is. It's working and those who want more of a voice in the organization will attend meetings and get more involved.
[17:50] <relle> and for the forums, when the forum volunteers come up with their plan, photomatt_wrk will respect their wishes.
[17:50] <relle> Titles are not something to be hated.
[17:50] <relle> They are signs of respect.
[17:50] <Morydd> In other words... IRC doesn't matter.
[17:50] <relle> No.
[17:50] <tunicwriter> Then what the hell about us IRC volunteers?
[17:51] <relle> If they can form as a group to come up with a plan and submit it, then it will be considered.
[17:51] <relle> This is just talk.
[17:51] <photomatt_wrk> that's a good point as well
[17:51] <relle> Does anyone have a solid plan in writing?
[17:51] <relle> You have a page on the Codex.
[17:51] <relle> Get a group together.
[17:51] <Morydd> anyone here read what I wrote before?
[17:51] <relle> Make a plan
[17:51] <relle> Write it down.
[17:51] <photomatt_wrk> How about... when we get poll functionality on wordpress.org we can put the IRC voice issue to a poll
[17:51] <relle> many times.
[17:51] <tunicwriter> I'm sorry, but I don't spend time helping people on here for my health, and I don't expect a title because I don't deserve it, but soooo many people on here help out so much, sometimes spending hours of their time helping people. Why not recognize them?
[17:51] <photomatt_wrk> whatever the IRC users decide will happen
[17:51] <photomatt_wrk> but right now I feel like we're hearing a noisy minority
[17:52] <relle> tunicwriter: we're trying to.
[17:52] <relle> agreed
[17:52] <Morydd> Open Source software is a noisy minorty.
[17:52] <tunicwriter> IRC support iis a minority...
[17:52] <relle> IRC support is valuable and extremely worthwhile.
[17:52] <skeltoac> I am happy to help without a "badge". Recognition comes with time.
[17:52] <photomatt_wrk> I guess we'll find out in the poll
[17:53] <relle> NEXT?
[17:53] <photomatt_wrk> moving on
[17:53] <photomatt_wrk> " Status of new site and server."
[17:53] <relle> Codex: status of new site and server?
[17:54] <photomatt_wrk> for the Codex to work on the new hosting arrangement they need to make some changes to their software, which we have to wait for their next scheduled rollout for
[17:54] * Quits: skeltoac|away (Connection timed out?)
[17:54] <mdawaffe> (btw - refresh your agenda)
[17:54] <photomatt_wrk> however right now it's on dedicated hardware I paid for and seems to be running very well
[17:54] <photomatt_wrk> the image uploading has also been fixed
[17:54] <relle> GREAT.
[17:55] <photomatt_wrk> when it's ready to go I'll make a DB snapshot that day and we'll switch it over
[17:55] <photomatt_wrk> it should only be a transition period of less than an hour
[17:55] <relle> All of us on the documentation team are thrilled to finally have the Codex stable. Thank you.
[17:55] <photomatt_wrk> " MediaWiki + bbPress = possible?"
[17:55] <mdawaffe> robla?
[17:55] <relle> http://codex.wordpress.org/User:RobLa/bbPress_Auth_for_MediaWiki
[17:55] <robla> yes. there's a few things in the spec that need clearing up
[17:56] <photomatt_wrk> that looks good, the only problem is the codex and forums are on different servers
[17:56] * mdawaffe chuckles
[17:56] <robla> k...I'll set it up to connect to two different dbs
[17:57] <photomatt_wrk> that sounds good
[17:57] <robla> photomatt_wrk: thanks for the mail on monday...that cleared up some things
[17:57] <photomatt_wrk> however will it need to connect on every page load?
[17:57] <photomatt_wrk> the servers are geographically disperse
[17:58] <robla> it'll take advantage of whatever connection caching is going on
[17:58] <photomatt_wrk> okay
[17:58] <photomatt_wrk> I guess let's see how it performs, then fix it if it isn't up to snuff
[17:58] <relle> I'm probably jumping the gun but Jalenack and ringmaster have been working on a cool plugin
[17:58] <relle> It adds a search to the Admin Panels for Codex and Forums
[17:58] <jalenack> yeah, let me pastebin the new version
[17:59] <relle> It's AWESOME.
[17:59] <jalenack> its completely different
[17:59] <jalenack> better i mean ;)
[17:59] <photomatt_wrk> A saw a screenshot of that on owen's site
[17:59] <relle> The idea of "Search First" will take on a new meaning.
[17:59] <jalenack> http://phpfi.com/70802
[17:59] <relle> The more we connect the two dots, but better quality of support we give users.
[17:59] * Quits: factoryjoe (Remote closed the connection?)
[18:00] <photomatt_wrk> can't wait to see where that goes
[18:00] <photomatt_wrk> finally, let's talk about the atom API
[18:00] <relle> Atom API: status?
[18:00] <photomatt_wrk> currently, we don't support it
[18:00] * Joins: factoryjoe
[18:00] <photomatt_wrk> the thinking was... wait until it's finished so we don't have to do the work twice
[18:00] <photomatt_wrk> it's almost finished
[18:01] <relle> Will it be added as a patch?
[18:01] <photomatt_wrk> we should start looking into implementing it, though I suspect it will be a bit of a pain
[18:01] <deeje> what kind of issues do you anticipate?
[18:01] <photomatt_wrk> mostly in the authentication part
[18:02] <deeje> ah
[18:02] <stevecooley> does the metaweblog API code show any kind of pathway for the atom code to be written?
[18:02] <michel_v> the atom API needs some thinking in the authentication part
[18:03] <photomatt_wrk> stevecooley: we have functions on the backend that everything resolves to
[18:03] <photomatt_wrk> so new_post is the same no matter what the interface
[18:03] <photomatt_wrk> all the work is in creating the interface
[18:03] <stevecooley> ok, I see
[18:03] * Parts: jefte
[18:03] <photomatt_wrk> the good news is, 95% of tools support metaweblog API already, and we also support the MT extensions
[18:04] <photomatt_wrk> we may also want to consider our own extensions for things like custom fields
[18:04] <deeje> yes, that's true
[18:04] <deeje> the specs for the metaweblog API aren't crystal clear though, so implementing them froma client perspective is especially challenging
[18:04] <deeje> lots of tools have done it
[18:04] <stevecooley> with varying degrees of success
[18:05] <michel_v> last time I checked, only hosted stuff supported the Atom API
[18:05] <photomatt_wrk> michel_v: also the main supporters were hosted services
[18:05] <michel_v> Blogger, TypePad, what else? they use HTTP Digest auth, IIRC. that kind of auth requires access to a clear version of the password
[18:06] <photomatt_wrk> which we can't do because we store the password encrypted in the DB
[18:06] <michel_v> there's a very very old message of mine on the atom ML raising the concern for authentication with salted passwords
[18:06] <michel_v> and basically the replies were "not our problem"
[18:06] <photomatt_wrk> it looks like how MT is going to work around it is by having a separate password for RPC access that they store plain-text
[18:06] <photomatt_wrk> however that raises exactly the same problem with why we haven't stored passwords in plain text in the first place
[18:07] <michel_v> that is excruciatingly ugly. Mark Pilgrim had HTTP versions of SOAP security stuff
[18:07] <deeje> perhaps the issue can be revisited on the APP WG?
[18:07] <michel_v> sadly, one that could have worked, missed the Encryption-type thingie element in the HTTP version
[18:07] <stevecooley> the what?
[18:07] <photomatt_wrk> actually I misspoke earlier, the syndication format is almost done, the API is still being worked on
[18:07] <deeje> correct
[18:08] <photomatt_wrk> michel_v: would you be willing to look into what challenges implementing the API would cause us, and we can summarize that in a publicized blog post to the API WG?
[18:08] <photomatt_wrk> not just us, any program in a non-hosted environment
[18:09] <photomatt_wrk> if your previous messages were ignored, we can publicize it more to generate buzz
[18:09] <michel_v> sure
[18:09] <michel_v> I just need more research in the way of plausible authentication schemes
[18:09] <photomatt_wrk> we don't need to present a solution, just state the problem
[18:09] <michel_v> because it would be cool to find one that worked, but uncool to find one that isn't implemented :p
[18:10] <michel_v> well, one possible solution would be to use classic/digest http auth, but make clients know which encryption method to use
[18:10] * Quits: Tom39|work (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)?)
[18:10] <photomatt_wrk> it's like in congress the minority party never needs to present a better plan, just point out problems with the current one
[18:10] <michel_v> so they would do Digest auth for example, but they would know that for WP they need to use md5 on the password before doing the auth
[18:11] <photomatt_wrk> so we could compare a double hashed value
[18:11] <tunicwriter> photomatt_wrk: that's a sign of a bad system... not a good way to go about things.
[18:11] <photomatt_wrk> michel_v: do you have a user page on the codex?
[18:12] <michel_v> I don't think I have. I'm allergic to mediawiki :)
[18:12] <photomatt_wrk> it'd be excellent to follow the progress of the document and invite comments
[18:12] <photomatt_wrk> do you have a preferred method?
[18:12] <michel_v> I think I'll become productive very soon though. I'm gonna buy a used ~900 Mhz G4
[18:12] <relle> photomatt_wrk: Is it time to ask about the big announcement you have to make about the forum count?
[18:12] <michel_v> at last, OSX's text editors ...at home
[18:14] <photomatt_wrk> michel_v: cool, I'll bring it up on the hackers list, from the discussion there we can have someone synthesize a codex page
[18:14] <photomatt_wrk> we can end up the meeting with two announcements
[18:14] <mdawaffe> michel_v: (what's your editor of choice?)
[18:14] <photomatt_wrk> first, wordpress.org passed 25,000 registered users
[18:15] <relle> WEEEEEE
[18:15] <michel_v> mdawaffe: I alternate between textmate and bbedit
[18:15] <photomatt_wrk> and second, we're a "platinum sponsor" of the BBS - http://www.blogbusinesssummit.com/sponsors.htm
[18:15] <relle> congrats.
[18:15] <photomatt_wrk> right under microsoft and boeing
[18:15] <mdawaffe> photomatt_wrk: you should give schwag to user 31337 when he/she rolls around
[18:15] <mdawaffe> michel_v: (cool)
[18:15] <mdawaffe> sweet
[18:15] <relle> UNDER?
[18:15] <skeltoac> Awesome, Matt!
[18:15] <michel_v> heh, where's 6A in the sponsors' list? ;)
[18:16] <relle> WOW.
[18:16] <photomatt_wrk> there will be a significant discount for WP users as well
[18:16] <photomatt_wrk> notable that last year WP wasn't *even mentioned* at this conference
[18:16] <relle> WordPress is under a company I used to work for and a company I lived next door to.
[18:16] <relle> WOW.
[18:16] <photomatt_wrk> I'll blog about the discount when the details are worked out
[18:16] <jalenack> sweet
[18:17] <relle> Congrats to you and everyone.
[18:17] <relle> This is wonderful.
[18:17] <photomatt_wrk> final announcement
[18:17] <relle> PR Team - time to promote this!!!! WEEE
[18:17] Auto away:? 30mins of no action
[18:17] Auto Away deactivated, manual Away set:?10 Auto Away:? 30mins of no action
[18:17] Auto away is active
[18:17] <photomatt_wrk> Ryan is actually in northern CA this week
[18:17] <photomatt_wrk> ironically he's going to be in town the same time I'm going to be in Dallas
[18:17] <photomatt_wrk> but we're doing a meetup this Saturday, if anyone is in the area
[18:18] <photomatt_wrk> will also be blogged about shortly
[18:18] <photomatt_wrk> and unless anyone else has important announcements, that's a wrap
[18:18] * Parts: deeje
[18:18] <michel_v> maybe I need to find other WPers in Paris to organise a WP meetup there
[18:18] <relle> <end meetup>


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